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posted by Joe_Ice

this article

Sorry if this was posted once before... I don't know the name of the author but I think he can be found on Anabolic Minds...wel maybe not, bc he got flamed like a mofo for posting this... Anyway, I thought this was phenominal!

The fact is that big, strong guys are a dime a dozen, and many of them get that way in spite of their training knowledge than because of it.

I know what I’m talking about in the world of training not because I’m the biggest or the strongest (although, at 270lbs and an 800 squat, 600 bench, and 700 deadlift I can hold my own), and not because I know the most about exercise phys (though I can hold my own there too), but because I have trained with and become friends with best. I have trained at Westside Barbell Club, with the Metal Militia, talk on a continual basis with the best strength coaches in the nation and world-wide, and the training methods I prescribe have been tested in the gym on literally hundreds and hundreds of regular, everyday athletes and shown to work. Period.

So here’s what I can stand before you today and say with great conviction what I know to be true about training:

1) I believe in general that the majority of people don’t work hard enough. If there’s one thing we can learn from the old Eastern Bloc countries, it’s that they worked harder than us, and that primarily, is why they always beat us in the Olympics. Work hard in the gym (even if your program sucks) and you will be rewarded.

2) I also believe that most people don’t put near enough emphasis on lower body and core work. The key to getting big is full squats and deadlifts. If you are looking at your routine and you see that you are training upper body 3 or 4 days per week and lower body once, you have a serious problem. The majority of athletes should live and die in the squat rack.

3) And for that matter, EVERYONE’S program should be centered around these exercises: Full Squat, Deadlifts (or cleans or both), heavy barbell rows, bench press, and Standing Barbell Military/Push Presses. Add pull ups, barbell curls, dips, heavy abdominal work, and some core work (back extensions, reverse hypers, or glute hams) and that should make up 95-100% of the total number of exercises you do. The most effective training is simple and hard.

4) Training a bodypart once per week (and one bodypart per day) is one of the worst ways to train. It will create a rut in your training that you can’t dig out of.

Training a bodypart twice per week has always been shown to be superior to once per week training of a muscle. The problem is with the influx of "Weider Principles" and other bodybuilding trash that's posted in the magazines, the masses have been stuck in the one-bodypart-per-day-per-week rut for years.

No strength athletes train a bodypart once per week. Most olympic lifters, powerlifters, and strongman train their backs at least four times per week, and last time I checked, they weren't lacking in back width.

The simple fact is that training using an upper/lower split or a push/pull split or 3 full body days will provide double or triple the training stimulus than training a muscle once per week and thus, if done correctly will lead to much, much greater growth and strength gains.

5) Training to near muscular failure has shown to induce identical hypertrophy gains than training to all out muscular failure. The reason you guys can’t train a muscle more than once per week is because you are destroying it when you do train it. Learn to hit or miss that last rep and then call it done. Don’t do ridiculous amounts of forced reps, negatives, etc. until you literally can’t move the muscle. Take it to near failure and then your muscles will recover enough so that you can train them again in 3-4 days.

Understand that there is a huge difference in training to near failure and not training hard. I would never advocate to not train hard. Actually, quite the opposite – try to squat for 5 sets of 5 reps using only 10lbs less than your five rep max. That’s absolutely brutal. But when you get done, don’t go to the leg press machine and keep pounding out sets and stripping off weight until you literal can’t do a single leg press with only the sled. That’s absurd, and you can’t recover from it in 3 days.

6) Squat at least below parallel every time. Are you kidding me? I can’t believe some people are still quarter squatting and saying that riding a squat all the way to the ground is bad for your knees. Learn the facts. Stopping at or above parallel puts much more strain on your knees than going ass to grass. Plus going all the way down in an Olympic style back squat will put more mass on you than any other exercise. Period.

posted by Joe_Ice

7) Isolation exercises are absolute crap. 90% of your routine should be made up of full squats, deadlifts or cleans, bench press, standing overhead press, heavy barbell rows, pull-ups, dips, and core work (abs, glute ham raises, back extensions, reverse hypers). Isolation exercises and machines are the worst thing that ever happened to the weight training world.

8) Quit using pyramid rep schemes like 10,8,6,4,2 – Instead, your time would be better served doing boring (but effective) gut busting sets of 5x5 or 4x8-10 using the SAME WEIGHT for each set. They WILL produce better results than the pyramid scheme. BTW, check your ego at the door when you do these.

9) I’ll quote my good friend, Glenn Pendlay (the best S&C coach in the nation) for the next one:

"Most athletes do too many exercises. Many times they look over other peoples programs like they are at a buffet. They pick a little of this and a little of that from a variety of programs, and end up with something useless. People think you have to train each muscle with a different specific exercise. Many guys in college athletics would do better if they would just randomly slash off half of what they are doing, and then work twice as hard on the half that is left."

10) Another of my favorites from Glenn:

"im so sick and tired of hearing people who just started training who say they cant gain weight. jeez ive heard this crap so often. every day it seems i have some stupid kid ask me about how to gain weight... in resturants, at the grocery store, yo uname it. for some reason there seems to be a sign on my back or something. usually i know its worthless to talk to them, sometimes i actually waste my time. talked to a kid at the golden corral a couple of days ago. took almost an hour when i should have been enjoying my all you can eat steak night... 3 days later i see him in the gym when i just happened to go in to talk to a friend who i knew was there... kid was there doing preacher curls. said hi to me, then said well i talked to my friend about what you said and he said he tried it once and overtrained so i decided to do this thing i read about... on the other hand about 6 months ago i talked to this 6' tall, 150lb kid who wanted to know about getting stronger. kid had done well in judo, won some titles, also after that had done cycling, turned pro then quit a year later, quite a good road racer. he actually did what i told him i guess, about 3 months after i saw him the first time i saw hiim again, he weighed about 185... he wanted to try olympic weightlifting so i let him train with the team i coach. now hes weighing 204 and clean and jerking about 300lbs, 54lbs gained in 6 months. no drugs. olympic squat from 175lbs to 385lbs, front squat from 150lbs to 330lbs. hell be a good lifter, has a good work ethic. needs to be 240 and fairly lean, will compete eventually in the 231 pound class. will take about another 12-15 months i suppose. why is a kid like this the exception and not the rule? why will kids do the same old thing for years in the abscense of results, and not try anything new? what the hell is wrong with people. there is a gym in town, i know the owner so i go and talk to him sometimes, there are all these kids in there, skinny little ****s, doing curls. they never progress, you see the same faces one year to the next, same bodies too."

11) Ultra slow reps or TUT is, for the most part completely worthless. Will it work? Yes. But the total amount of work that one can complete is much lower when utilizing slow reps. Just go natural. Don’t try to be super fast, and bouncy, and don’t try to go ultra slow. Just do it naturally and controlled.

12) “The burn”, “the pump” and “the feel” have nothing to do with the effectiveness of an exercise. Yes, even I have been caught on upper body days looking at myself in the mirror when I’m all blown up, but that has nothing to do with the effectiveness of the last exercise. You do hammer strength bench presses and flyes for sets of 20 and I’ll do heavy barbell bench presses and deep dips. One of us will “feel the pump” more and the other one will grow.

13) Likewise, delayed onset muscle soreness (DOMS) also gives no clue as to the effectiveness of a workout. It just means A) you have a ton of microtrauma in a muscle or a lot of lactic acid/ waste products. Congratulations.

14) “Core stability training” is not done on a swiss ball or a stability board. It’s done by pulling heavy deadlifts, standing overhead presses, full squats, heavy barbell rows, heavy farmer’s walks, Atlas stones, tire flipping, reverse hypers, heavy back extensions, glute ham raises, and heavy abdominal work.

15) A good gym has nothing to do with how nice the machines are or if they have a pool or tanning beds or even if it’s air conditioned. A good gym smells like a mix of body odor and liniment and supplies their members with a big box of chalk.

Kelly Baggett, one of the best strength coaches his take as well on how to get bigger

This is not to attack anyone but I'd be willing to bet a lot more natural muscle has been built using the recommnedations of Matt and Glenn over the years then all the complicated bodybuilding schemes out there. The problem with bodybuilders is they try to overcomplicate everything and lose site of the big picture.....that's making strength gains in the gym on basic movements along with scale weight increases on a week to week basis. Now you can complicate that as much as you want but those are the only 2 things it takes to get big. It doesn't take any sort've fancy specialized training routines and special diets. If more people would spend more time in dark stinky ass gyms worrying about putting weight on the very basic movements and spend more time eating in high volume (note the golden corral reference) with an emphasis on gaining scale weight then a lot more muscle would be built.
For every bodybuilder who has success building a physique naturally I'll show you at least 20 who don't get jack **** in the way of results because they sit around with their thumb up their butt worrying about this and worrying about that and basing everything off of their "pump"...worrying about the "feel" of this exercise and trying to trash the muscle every workout without any regards to periodization and failign to realize that if they would've just strived to put 50 lbs on their squat and 15 lbs on the scale their problems would be taken care of......They go starving themselves to death on boiled chicken and broccoli while spending $300 per month in supplements thinking they can get "bigger" and "smaller" at the same time spending 5 years wasting time not gaining 10 lbs of scale weight all while looking at strength athletes with their nose up in the air when what they don't realize is that fat powerlifter they like to make fun of has actually put on 50 lbs of muscle in the last year and he could spend 3 months stripping that fat off and hand you your ass and balls in a bodybuilding contest simply because he trained very simple, focused on strength gains and most importnatly wasn't afraid to sit down at the dinner table and do some serious eating.

Give me 2 twin brothers one who hangs around with and reads bodybuilding related info for a year and another who hangs around with and trains at a powerlifting gym both without steroids and after that year is over let's see which one builds more muscle. Nine times out of 10 I'll take the powerlifter.

Having said that a strenght athletes routine may not be 100% optimal for a bodybuilder but there are a lot of things people could learn from strength trainers.
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posted by estray

Great read.

posted by Improvise

Good read, can you provide a link, I'd like to share it with others.

posted by Joe_Ice

I cant.. I cant even find the authors name but I know he lurks on the boards

posted by cwshorns

improvise- run a search, i think tsm posted this once before. i know i've seen it on here

posted by president_fad

that is good shit rite there.

posted by estray

Fad and Joe: how many times a week do you guys do squats, deads, and bench?

posted by Joe_Ice

twice. 1 heavy day 1 speed day

posted by president_fad

i do heavy squats and bench every week, but i only do heavy deads once every 3-4 weeks. I have an injury which effects my dead, so i dont do them that often plus i think GMs, pullthroughs, box squats, and a few other various exercises are better for increasing your dead.

But if youre training for size, i would say stay in the 2-4 rep range and you could do them every week if youre CNS would allow it.

posted by Improvise

That article basically stated that you should be doing those power lifts at least twice a week. Less sets and more frequently.

posted by Joe_Ice

many peeps dont d/l often, esp PL-ers... Some do, a lot dont. but u're right thats what the articl did insinuate. doing the big lifts at least twice a week, for the peeple who dont d/l every week like mywelf we just use the special exercises that train the d/l muscles w/o dl-ing

posted by Improvise

Special exercises that train the dead-lift muscles without dead-lifting? Please tell me you are not saying you can substitute exersises like hamstring curls, dumbbell romanian deadlifts, reverse hypers, back extensions, etc. for deadlift?

posted by president_fad

theres more than one way to train properly, i prefer the latter. This article has alot of good points, not all to which i adhere to.

posted by president_fad

well put it this way. i dled 500 in november. Have dled probably 5-6 times since then. My dead is now at 570. So i guess, IMO, if you want a big dead, i wouldnt DL all the time.

posted by Improvise

Doesn't mean anything to me.

posted by Joe_Ice

Good Mornings, SLDLs, reverse hypers, pull thrus, zercher squats, low box squats, gnhrs will all train the dead lift without doing it.... I D/L once every 3-4 weeks and hit PRs

posted by president_fad

are you trying to be a dickhead?

posted by president_fad

exactley.

posted by Improvise

Nah I'm just saying that won't work for everyone. It worked for you but I'm willing to bet money that it wouldn't work for me.

posted by bleeke

lets hear some feedback from some mods on this article.

posted by Joe_Ice

You probably arent implementing anything right then bc it works for everyone else, could be over training or something of the like... and wwat are your squat, deads and bench at and how big are you?

posted by Joe_Ice

If you rely on MODs and VETs as to be your only reliable source of info , you're doing yourself a disfavor. MANY MANY mods and vets are just friends of the owner, not what their titles actually imply.

posted by bignready

i also would like to hear some of the mods takes on this.

posted by Joe_Ice

why do i even share info lol......

posted by president_fad

are you going for a big dead, or size?

Cus i guarantee it would work, lots of PLers dont do deads that often, they do a variation of them, with bands, chains, but rarely do they do regular deads unless preparing for a meet. Same with squats, hardly ever do full squats.

posted by president_fad

relying on info from mods/vets isnt always the best thing. Not discrediting anyone here, but joes rite most the time mods are friends of the owner and dont even work out, or if they do, its half assed.

posted by bleeke

i can start off by saying that after a while you start to form an amount of trust in some people. thanks to the guys that have been here from my start, i have learned a huge amount from them. this is a forum, a place where people can discuss the sport or anything related to it, share information, tips................
they are only here to help and i realize that certain excercises may work for one but not on another. :clap: MODS:clap:

posted by Joe_Ice

Do what you want bleeke, im just here to share info.

posted by bleeke

thats cool, i love info. trying to absorb as much as possible. just asking what everyone thinks of this article.

posted by Improvise

I haven't done deads in a long time. Don't do 'em cuz my hamstrings are too tight and I use too much of my back to carry the weight.

I'm not a big guy, 20 years old, 5'10" 170.

Max squat = 315
Max Bench = 250-260

Trying to get bigger. Don't think I'm criticizing what you're saying and going against it, just don't know how much truth I myself can put into an article without an author even listed. A lot of powerlifts can hurt you in the long run especially if you're form isn't right. I already have a bad back so I don't want to do anything to f*ck it up more.

posted by CUTS

uh ok. to say the mods here dont know what they're talking about is dumb to say. i think they all have some good experience

posted by president_fad

DUDE youre a complete ****in moron, seriously. you obviously didnt read anything i said. I seriously hope you die.

posted by Improvise

roid rage!@!!!!

posted by rotty34

WOW!!! Never thought this could be such a sensitive subject. I'd say that the knowledge of the MODS or any book, magazine, etc. is good knowledge to have. But, every person is different. What works for some, doesn't for others. Each person has to take the knowledge they've received and find out which of all of it works for them.

Just my 2cents, though

posted by Joe_Ice

^ thats what improvise said and looks at his #s :D

and Improvise, FAD is natural

posted by Joe_Ice

looks like all the small weak eople disagreed, hows that for proof

posted by Improvise

LOL you're a dickhead.

posted by CUTS

pres and joe are both dickheads. they also have really low self esteem because they rag on EVERYONE. i think they have a thing for each other but i'll let you guys decide hehehe

posted by estray

Could be on to something. Haha

posted by CUTS

i read what you put but i still didnt agree with you. so im a ****in moron because of it? you hurting inside? i can help if you wanna talk about it

posted by goldentornado22

so pres.. how does that make you feel:laughing:

posted by president_fad

obviously you didnt read what i said, or you wouldnt have said that you cant believe i said the mods here dont know what theyre talk about when i didnt. :screwy: Seriously, ill buy you a gun and a bullet if youll pull the trigger. Youll save everyone here alot of trouble.

posted by CUTS

i think you and joe are the only ones bothered here. i just didnt agree with your comment. if it was about these mods or other mods...i dont think you can say "most" dont even work out. thats all im sayin

posted by president_fad

im just bothered by the fact that you look like a basketball player, yet youre on gear. Everyone here hates you, i dont see why you stay.

posted by CUTS

lol does everyone hate me? and dude who cares if i look like a basketball player on gear? you once looked like a basketball player too! it like you dont understand people arent born big. me being on steroids has nothing to do with it.

but really who hates me???

posted by president_fad

every mod hates you and wishes you were gone cause of your ignorant advice.

posted by president_fad

every mod hates you and wishes you were gone cause of your ignorant advice.

posted by CUTS

yea some mods dont like me but you speak for all of them?

posted by Smallguy

ok no one has said antyting here and some peopel have asked for the mods opinions.

There are 2 schools of though o geting big lifts so swear by you gotta dead lift ot get a big dead lift

I like joe and pres have fond my DL... PR was 395.. goes up when I don't hit deads every week instead I'll alternat dead lifts with block pulls or rack deads.

What everyone has ot relaize is that raining is so unique for everyone....you mgiht bealbeo t dead lift every week and make great gians whiel others have to rotate all articles are merely a matter of opinion on what has worked for the paerson or what they have seen work it does;nt mean a different methosd may not be better for you.

posted by Joe_Ice

;) just stating whats out there :laughing: :thumbs:

posted by CUTS

you have a pretty big mouth. you arent much bigger than anyone on here Joe.

posted by Joe_Ice

you being on steroids has everything to ****in do w/ it lol. U're right none of us were born big so we all worked out and paid our dues in the gym then used gear. what are u getting at

posted by Joe_Ice

I never claim to be the biggest or stronges, but i am no 5'10'' 180 lb dude on gear... andm y lifts arent the greatest by any means, but they definately beat most of the small and weak guys

posted by CUTS

you guys keep talking about my size and the fact i do steroids. so if i was small you would make fun of me and if i did steroids you would make fun of me. cant win

posted by president_fad

who do you see me raggin on here? 18 yr olds who want to use gear, or 19yr old who claim to be on HRT for life, yet need to run 3 times the needed amount along with 2 other compounds. You dont see me raggin on the 120lb kid trying to get a routine goin, or the overweight person gettin their bf low. I dont care if you can dl 135, as long as your doing them, and if youre progressing thats what i wanna see. I dont care who you are, its proven that squats and deads will put on mass, if you dont wanna do them youre a ****in pussy.

posted by CUTS

Joe, i dont doubt you can lift alot but you really do have a big mouth

posted by Joe_Ice

exactly, if u were ur size now and training naturally and doing everything u can to exert more of your time getting bigger and stronger naturally ide respect:thumbs:

posted by CUTS

well im progressing but its not your method so its wrong. if i wernt on steroids you would treat me differently.

posted by Joe_Ice

ude be a cool cat

posted by CUTS

if you guys dont respect me because i chose to do steroids thats fine but please stop attacking me at every disagreement. ok guys?

posted by president_fad

but you arent big, youre a little dueschebag who was small when he used, and now thinks he knows tons about it and can give advice to people about it.

posted by Joe_Ice

I just pposted abuncha training principals i thought would help out here and the resopnses from the little pip squiks were "this is wrong and i want mods opinions" :banghead:

posted by president_fad

anyone would progress on 650test deca and drol or whatever youre doing. :fu:

posted by CUTS

Joe i said nothing about it being a wrong method. this started because i didnt agree with Pres. comment. and pres im not small and i wasnet small before i started a cycle. i couldnt lift as much as you but you cant call me small

posted by Joe_Ice

HRT fad HRT... at 19 the test lovels drop wel below normal,... and cuts ur a bean pole!

posted by president_fad

u were like 5'11 180, thats not big.

posted by CUTS

so basically you guys dont like me cuz i give advice and im on steroids. you guys have 1 more year experience and youre natural as of now. so i dont think you guys have alot of room to rag on me. if you dont respect me because of my steroid use ok but lets stop the bickering guys

posted by CUTS

its not small!

posted by Joe_Ice

http://bbforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1052&d=1139766429

This is big????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

posted by CUTS

its a start but im not tiny. its a start dude and you tak about not raggin on the "little" guys. you were once there. this is me a few weeks ago and i dont think im small Pres.

posted by CUTS

by no means am i saying im big or huge but to say im small is retarded. can we be done now?

posted by Joe_Ice

If u came off gear you would probably shirnk up, but would anyone guess u were on steroids trhere? I wouldnt

posted by CUTS

cuz at that point i was only on for like 2 weeks

posted by president_fad

bball

posted by CUTS

whos cares if i look like a basketball player? im trying to get bigger. dont rag on the little guys Pres.

posted by Joe_Ice

hes not....................just the ones using gear

posted by CUTS

better rag on half the guys here then

posted by president_fad

they arent 19

posted by John H

this is going nowhere and its really destructive. while some of you guys may not agree with one another it would be nice for you to respect eachothers choices, if you want to debate thats fine but you guys are bickering like 3 eight-year olds over the last oreo cookie. all im sayin is that hatred is not something i want to see around here and i know im not alone.

posted by goldentornado22

i love oreos but havent had one for about a year...

posted by estray

I agree. This is makin this board an uncool place to be. You can disagree with someone whitout attacking them personally. Thats just childish. It shows your age.

posted by CUTS

i agree. im just trying to defend myself

posted by estray

I wasnt necessarily referring to you. Its pretty obvious to anyone whos been watching where this whole thing started.

posted by president_fad

aww im so heartbroken a few people on here think im immature. Ill defend my principles till the day i die in whatever means neccesary. You can tell when a chick is a stupid bitch too, by their posts.

posted by canibalistic_js

I just read this post by Joe and I agree that is some true sh*t. Bump

posted by cwshorns

i don't think you should sweat it...sh*t, most of what is said on here is people's own opinion and what's probably worked for them. Believe half of what you hear and a quarter of what you read

posted by canibalistic_js

Yup.....I agree its an opnion not the law.

posted by president_fad

that was sarcasm....lol

posted by canibalistic_js

damn you think you could maybe make it a little more abvious?

posted by bignready

bump...i agree totally

posted by president_fad

noooooooooooooooooooi cannnnnnnnnnnttttttttttttttttttttttt

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