first cycle

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posted by AMERFOOTBALL

I know im probably going to catch a few flames about this, and im willing to roll with them. but here is what ive got in mind for my first cycle. im 21 years old, 6' 245 lbs with bf around 20%, when i do this cycle in a few months i should be around 15 or 16%.

Week 1-14 sust 250mg eod
week 9-14 winstrol 50mg ed
12 days after last poke of sust 300mg clomid then 100mg ed for 2 weeks.
hcg @ 3000 iu every 4th week

I would like to run proviron with this cycle but need some help on dosages and schedules with it.

posted by jcvaughn26

don't like it for a first cycle. First I'd drop the winny and second I wouldn't be going with susta EOD for a first cycle little too much. Stick to 500mg of a long ester. contrary to what I have always believed and read in some articles about susta that to get the full effect of the mixed esters.... is it acts like a long ester so I know I have always said EOD is best really 500mg of susta will act like a long ester so EOD or E3D isn't necissary, so I have just currently read. (we had a thread on anoth board about this. And for the HCG 3000iu in one shot?? That is WAY too much IMO, could cause leydig cell problems.... I'll quote Swales a HRT doctor.....

"It is important that no more than 500IU of HCG be administered on any given day. There is only just so much stimulation possible, and exceeding that not only is wasteful, doing so has important negative consequences. Higher doses overly stimulate testicular aromatase, which inappropriately raises estrogen levels, and brings on the detrimental effects of same. It also causes Leydig cell desentization to LH, and we are therefore inducing primary hypogonadism while perhaps treating secondary hypogonadism. 250IU QD is an effective, and safe, dose. After all, we are merely replacing that which is lost to inhibition."

"Any more than 500IU of HCG per day causes too much aromatase activity. Some feel aromatase is actually toxic to the Leydig cells of the testes. You are then inducing primary hypogonadism (which is permanent) while treating steroid-induced secondary (hypogonadotrophic) hypogonadism (which is temporary--hopefully)."

I would go with the HCG 2x a week at 250iu-500ius or at the end of the cycle. Just my opinion.

Go with the bread and butter cycle Test only. Winny was dissapointing for me just caused joint pain.

posted by Joe_Ice

looks fine run some ldex w/ ur clomid

posted by CUTS

personaly i wouldnt go longer than 10 weeks. doesnt make sense to me because i dont think you gain anything passed 10 weeks. might be different for other people but thats just what i've seen. i agree with jcvaughn, i would just make it easy on yourself and do cyp or e. good luck bro!

posted by AMERFOOTBALL

thanks bros. would like some more opinions on both cycles...the first one vs. this one...

test e 14 weeks 250mg twice a week, monday and thursdays
pct 10 days after last poke.
would still like to run proviron with either cycle.

posted by Joe_Ice

longer the cycle the better. 12 week minimum IMO... u need time for your bodoy to adjust to the gians u made

posted by cwshorns

amer- is there a particular reason why you wanted to run winny?

posted by AMERFOOTBALL

wanted to run winny for the strength and to pull the water out at the end. i should be under 12 by the end of the cycle, so it would be nice to gain hardness...

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